According to Digital, making the scripts for the quests is the fun part, and where you get to be creative. The tedious and boring part is the conditions. So is it really worth it to even make a script converter, when just re-doing the scripts isn't even that tough and can be fun for some?
Oblivion and Skyrim in OpenMW? Being able to play through both storylines with my Morrowind character? That would be awesome. :)
I don't think it's worth making a script converter as the time and effort making one will be far more time consuming than rewriting the scripts from scratch.
The tedious and boring part is the conditions. So is it really worth it to even make a script converter, when just re-doing the scripts isn't even that tough and can be fun for some?
Its about ensuring the potential conversion of the 26964 mods available to Oblivion (that is just the Nexus). Then for possibilty of a next conversion the 24223 mods for Skyrim (and growing of course).
Oblvion/Skyrim can always be downgraded to Morrowind format plugins and used with OpenMW.
I've become more convinced that the future of keeping mods "alive" is with an expanded OpenMW. I've done a post on their website about an OpenTamriel/OpenGamebyro and it is surely something that will be planned for.
But rather than downgrading to a Morrowind version of BSA, Nif, etc, surely a more universal format that contains more information as used by Oblivion and Skyrim would be better? This includes scripting of course.
You might see oblivion scripting, OBSE, papyrus scripting, SKSE all being converted to some format that OpenMW can process.
I think that OpenMW already has its own way to save plugins.
I think both these projects success will still be on conversion. As Zilav says even if it was downgraded, its a conversion. But far more likely to upgrade, and not necessarily to a Skyrim format either. After all OpenMW is based on Orge3D and C++, so really as long as it has the data (game settings) and a successful way to convert models and their physics, having conversion tools will be the key to playing Elder Scroll games and the 50,000+ mods well into the next decade, and really forever. As Orge3D progresses its framework, so does the potential to keep updating everything. The Skywind project is proving that we can keep updating models, animations, textures that can see the game well into the future. Admittedly we gear everything towards Skyrim format at the moment, but we save our current processes so that they can be edited later to port/convert into what ever the future holds.
I see that conversion tools will be less about porting into another TES game, and more about a universal method for conversion for OpenMW (lets start calling it OpenGamebyro). I think that these two communities will start merging as we basically have the same goals. Older games in newer engines.
Yep scripting Skywind is fun because that's where you see things progress (like when I prototyped the crime system in Seyda Neen last week-end or when you can finally playthrough a quest). It's fun if you like coding a bit. It can be challenging if you have difficult things to do ;) And I'm pretty sure someone with a level design mind can have as much fun placing rocks ;)
Conditions are boring when you do them in batch like I did until recently, just to hide topics. Starting with the next master, we can work on them when we work on a given quest. The changes will be mostly "transparent" from now on.
sorry I digressed on this.... Regarding script conversion, I think it's difficult/impossible but I'm sure some code wizards can prove me wrong ;)
No water, but still better than black/purple mess. I'm not sure I want to spend any more time on this, because both CK and OScape are buggy as hell and take ages to complete anything. Trees/Objects LOD is another big problem, because they are generated by CK only and hence probably won't work with lodsetting file from OScape. Lets just hope that more advanced LOD tools will be developed in future.
Looks good already, we'd better add big rocks and other objects before generating static lod anyway (for the trees lod it seems GKB will release a tutorial soon).
anyway can we have a little release?^^ (even without quests or scripts for now, just to see what it looks like).
If that's so^^ The fixed bushes are in this pack (http://www.sendspace.com/file/mm9ivb)you don't need the esp of course. They are not really converted (I don't know how to convert .SPT, I 've just put the texture on other bush meshes but It looks acceptable).
And here are a few interior meshes for ayleid ruins with fixed transparency (you can find the other fixed meshes in the thread "skyblivion fixed meshes") : http://www.sendspace.com/file/dpze2q
OMG I got a tree lod working with landscape lod! This required some trickery, but it works! Too bad I can't create objects lod since it requires low poly meshes. And I can't model at all.
Screenshots of Weynon Priory, Imperial Sewers Exit and Waterfront. Damn Oblivion textures look awful with Skyrim's lighting, they should be redone completely.
Oo I didn't expected it to be so fast^^ Do all the trees have different lod meshes? (so that we can easily replace them one by one). And If you want low poly meshes, download "really almost everything visible when distant" on oblivion nexus. http://oblivion.nexusmods.com/mods/20053 (for the basic city distant meshes, they are already in the vanilla game).
It's really hard to wait once you've seen something like this^^
About textures: There are many mods for Oblivion that provide great retextures. We would only need permissions, and so far every modder I have spoken to has heartily agreed to let us use their stuff. :)
I think the only things that really would need a retexture would be the landscape and small objects that can now be seen in the inventory, like food.
Edit: Oh, and This thread has some LOD files for the imperial city walls. The textures are a little weird I think, but far better than nothing. :)
And I've seen you added grass, this is the original converted grass if you want to add it yourself (you must let them in the landscape/grass folder or it wont work), the animation issue with some of them is normal for now ; ) http://www.sendspace.com/file/9cer5p
Added appropriate clothes to all NPCs so they are no longer naked.
Bad news - I no longer have a free time, at least for now. My intention was to polish Skyblivion with scripts in TES5Edit for some time to make it more appealing and attract more people to this site (maybe someone will even join and help with development).
I'll release soon as it is now :(
p.s. hope someone will make a good video with hires textures, enb, etc.
Those look cool. I don't know why you added the "Reborn" though. That's not actually the project name, it's just put put to signify that this is a completely new conversion method, and a restart. The project name is just Skyblivion. :)
Спасибо большое, у меня самого руки бы не дошли :)
No problems :) У нас в планах снять еще один ролик, более структурированный. А то тут получился обычный летсплей. Если бы он еще не вылетал так часто... Сейчас еще новость напишу на http://elderscrolls.net. И да, я был шокирован, когда ответ получил на русском :)
The problem is meshes, some of them are either not converted (still Oblivion's nif format or simply missing), others reuse original mesh as a collision one so if they are high poly game's havok engine just crashes. If you know anyone who can help with mesh fixing, it'll be great (requires Blender, Nifscope, 3DMax, nif export/import plugins as far as I know). Or update NifConvert thas was used for the original meshes conversion. We had some programmers working on them, but they disappeared some time ago :(
I'm reworking many of the meshes. I see that many of them reuse the original mesh as collision, and do not use the proper material type. It's taking a long time though, there are almost 7000 nifs to fix! Last night I removed the unnecessary collision from the grass and plant meshes and it gave me a good improvement on ctds. There is a lot of work still to be done, though. It would be good if we could divide the job up among several people.
Thanks a lot for fixing meshes, but unfortunately there are no people now. The whole point of Skyblivion Reborn is to attract more people who are fans of Oblivion and can help. Lets hope those who can model will join in future.
p.s. Can you please post links to updated meshes somewhere, even if it is only a single mesh. It is so frustrating to read several threads on this site where someone posted his progress and then disappeared without anything left.
your welcome I might add more objects if I forgot anny of anithing like that , and Zilav you did in just some weeks what should have taken months or more.
its so nice to be able to finally go back to cyrodiil again
That is awesome Zardalu! Yes, please share regularly. :) Something Mehh did for Skywind to find broken meshes was to do a quick navmesh and if the CK crashed on a cell he would remove objects until the crashing stopped, and then we would know the last removed object was broken. I don't know if that method would be any help?
That LOD looks great too. I'll see how much it breaks my FPS. :)
Well one of the biggest culprits for crashing in Skywind, was floral with collision. If you remove the collision from those, you'll probably stop a lot of the crashing. If you go to Solstheim in Skywind, you'll find some floral with collision(we didn't wanna touch Bloodmoon/Tribunal stuff yet) and you'll probably ctd if you touch it.
The crashing right now is mainly due to bad collision, you'll need to find someone who knows how to fix bad collision.
Zilav I am amazed by what you did I asumed you work weeks before even speaking of it , you are a god.
so about the LOD I have not lost anny FPS but , my pc is a high so errrr not really good for benchmarking , I only did cities and some of the biger bridges so it should be ok for most pepole
Hey Zilav, can I make a request? That you release the scripts you used to convert this? What I want to do is basically convert over the Tamriel heightmap mod, and then use that to create some LOD that won't have weird edges like the current LOD.
Converting heightmap and merging it in will require much more work than simply painting edge cells in the current master, which will take 1-2 hours I believe for someone who knows CK well.
Or even faster, because you can just create a new region in those places outside of Cyrodiil and use automatic region generator in CK to fill it.
Thanks to grass from anthelius and LOD plugin, it really starting to look like Oblivion. We just need trees and bushes now, and tone down landscape textures to make them less bright with Skyrim's lighting.
Zilav I think the problem with the lighting is the over done bloom , so what if we disable bloom in its immagespaces? il try that and report back see if it changes anything
oh and it looks like I forgot to set some of the wall section in full lod , il do that when I have time
Yes the current weather and imagespaces from Skyrim doesn't work good for Oblivion (easy to notice with blue tint on screenshots and weird lighting). If you can manually recreate them with Oblivion values (tints, ambient colors, etc.) that'll be really great. Use CS or TES4Edit to look for original values from Oblivion.esm
Proper imagespaces and weather are like half of perception.
dont tone them to far down oblivion is a bright place i like to think that spring just started there and skyrim its more fall/winter and when u are high up on the mountain and u look over cyrendel the bright green is very nice on the eye
^ This.
According to Digital, making the scripts for the quests is the fun part, and where you get to be creative. The tedious and boring part is the conditions. So is it really worth it to even make a script converter, when just re-doing the scripts isn't even that tough and can be fun for some?
Oblivion and Skyrim in OpenMW? Being able to play through both storylines with my Morrowind character? That would be awesome. :)
I don't think it's worth making a script converter as the time and effort making one will be far more time consuming than rewriting the scripts from scratch.
Its about ensuring the potential conversion of the 26964 mods available to Oblivion (that is just the Nexus). Then for possibilty of a next conversion the 24223 mods for Skyrim (and growing of course).
I've become more convinced that the future of keeping mods "alive" is with an expanded OpenMW. I've done a post on their website about an OpenTamriel/OpenGamebyro and it is surely something that will be planned for.
But rather than downgrading to a Morrowind version of BSA, Nif, etc, surely a more universal format that contains more information as used by Oblivion and Skyrim would be better? This includes scripting of course.
You might see oblivion scripting, OBSE, papyrus scripting, SKSE all being converted to some format that OpenMW can process.
I think that OpenMW already has its own way to save plugins.
I think both these projects success will still be on conversion. As Zilav says even if it was downgraded, its a conversion. But far more likely to upgrade, and not necessarily to a Skyrim format either. After all OpenMW is based on Orge3D and C++, so really as long as it has the data (game settings) and a successful way to convert models and their physics, having conversion tools will be the key to playing Elder Scroll games and the 50,000+ mods well into the next decade, and really forever. As Orge3D progresses its framework, so does the potential to keep updating everything. The Skywind project is proving that we can keep updating models, animations, textures that can see the game well into the future. Admittedly we gear everything towards Skyrim format at the moment, but we save our current processes so that they can be edited later to port/convert into what ever the future holds.
I see that conversion tools will be less about porting into another TES game, and more about a universal method for conversion for OpenMW (lets start calling it OpenGamebyro). I think that these two communities will start merging as we basically have the same goals. Older games in newer engines.
@Mehh
Yep scripting Skywind is fun because that's where you see things progress (like when I prototyped the crime system in Seyda Neen last week-end or when you can finally playthrough a quest). It's fun if you like coding a bit. It can be challenging if you have difficult things to do ;) And I'm pretty sure someone with a level design mind can have as much fun placing rocks ;)
Conditions are boring when you do them in batch like I did until recently, just to hide topics. Starting with the next master, we can work on them when we work on a given quest. The changes will be mostly "transparent" from now on.
sorry I digressed on this.... Regarding script conversion, I think it's difficult/impossible but I'm sure some code wizards can prove me wrong ;)
My first attempt at LOD.
No water, but still better than black/purple mess. I'm not sure I want to spend any more time on this, because both CK and OScape are buggy as hell and take ages to complete anything. Trees/Objects LOD is another big problem, because they are generated by CK only and hence probably won't work with lodsetting file from OScape. Lets just hope that more advanced LOD tools will be developed in future.
Looks good already, we'd better add big rocks and other objects before generating static lod anyway (for the trees lod it seems GKB will release a tutorial soon).
anyway can we have a little release?^^ (even without quests or scripts for now, just to see what it looks like).
I'm still polishing it a bit with scripts in TES5Edit, so some time later.
I'll try to generate skyblivion LOD once the master is released. At least assuming the LOD will actually install correctly unlike the last master. :)
Hopefully I'll be able add a bit of water to the map.
It was just a bad LOD water height setting.
@anthelius
I saw you posted screenshots of converted Oblivion's bushes and some other fixed meshes, can you share them? I promise you'll get Skyblivion first :)
If that's so^^ The fixed bushes are in this pack (http://www.sendspace.com/file/mm9ivb)you don't need the esp of course. They are not really converted (I don't know how to convert .SPT, I 've just put the texture on other bush meshes but It looks acceptable).
And here are a few interior meshes for ayleid ruins with fixed transparency (you can find the other fixed meshes in the thread "skyblivion fixed meshes") : http://www.sendspace.com/file/dpze2q
SB has also converted over all the SI .spt files but they still need some work.
Anthelius, don't forget the Oblivion grass. :) Or is that what you meant by bushes?
OMG I got a tree lod working with landscape lod! This required some trickery, but it works! Too bad I can't create objects lod since it requires low poly meshes. And I can't model at all.
Screenshots of Weynon Priory, Imperial Sewers Exit and Waterfront. Damn Oblivion textures look awful with Skyrim's lighting, they should be redone completely.
i can almost hear "stop right there criminal scum, you violated the law" being shouted incessantly at me
Oo I didn't expected it to be so fast^^ Do all the trees have different lod meshes? (so that we can easily replace them one by one). And If you want low poly meshes, download "really almost everything visible when distant" on oblivion nexus. http://oblivion.nexusmods.com/mods/20053 (for the basic city distant meshes, they are already in the vanilla game).
It's really hard to wait once you've seen something like this^^
That looks sweet!
About textures: There are many mods for Oblivion that provide great retextures. We would only need permissions, and so far every modder I have spoken to has heartily agreed to let us use their stuff. :)
I think the only things that really would need a retexture would be the landscape and small objects that can now be seen in the inventory, like food.
Edit: Oh, and This thread has some LOD files for the imperial city walls. The textures are a little weird I think, but far better than nothing. :)
And I've seen you added grass, this is the original converted grass if you want to add it yourself (you must let them in the landscape/grass folder or it wont work), the animation issue with some of them is normal for now ; ) http://www.sendspace.com/file/9cer5p
ya love it
what a nostalgia seen this cant wait to play this doesn't need a lot of work the landscape when u see this
Added appropriate clothes to all NPCs so they are no longer naked.
Bad news - I no longer have a free time, at least for now. My intention was to polish Skyblivion with scripts in TES5Edit for some time to make it more appealing and attract more people to this site (maybe someone will even join and help with development).
I'll release soon as it is now :(
p.s. hope someone will make a good video with hires textures, enb, etc.
Don't worry it's already very appealing^^ We can still poilsh it later.
Released.
Good luck!
Some logos:
Also I'm uploading a video.
Those look cool. I don't know why you added the "Reborn" though. That's not actually the project name, it's just put put to signify that this is a completely new conversion method, and a restart. The project name is just Skyblivion. :)
I've attached PSD source, so anybody can delete this word :)
Video
@TERAB1T
Спасибо большое, у меня самого руки бы не дошли :)
zilav wrote:
No problems :) У нас в планах снять еще один ролик, более структурированный. А то тут получился обычный летсплей. Если бы он еще не вылетал так часто... Сейчас еще новость напишу на http://elderscrolls.net. И да, я был шокирован, когда ответ получил на русском :)
Don't forget you can get the original grass here: http://morroblivion.com/forums/skyblivion/skyblivion-mod-rel...
And the original music adds a lot to the atmosphere too ; ) (it seems you don't have as much ctd as me).
anthelius wrote:
I had CTDs every few minutes. I launched Skyrim again and again to record the next chapters of a video.
@TERAB1T
I'll use english here.
The problem is meshes, some of them are either not converted (still Oblivion's nif format or simply missing), others reuse original mesh as a collision one so if they are high poly game's havok engine just crashes. If you know anyone who can help with mesh fixing, it'll be great (requires Blender, Nifscope, 3DMax, nif export/import plugins as far as I know). Or update NifConvert thas was used for the original meshes conversion. We had some programmers working on them, but they disappeared some time ago :(
I'm reworking many of the meshes. I see that many of them reuse the original mesh as collision, and do not use the proper material type. It's taking a long time though, there are almost 7000 nifs to fix! Last night I removed the unnecessary collision from the grass and plant meshes and it gave me a good improvement on ctds. There is a lot of work still to be done, though. It would be good if we could divide the job up among several people.
Thanks a lot for fixing meshes, but unfortunately there are no people now. The whole point of Skyblivion Reborn is to attract more people who are fans of Oblivion and can help. Lets hope those who can model will join in future.
p.s. Can you please post links to updated meshes somewhere, even if it is only a single mesh. It is so frustrating to read several threads on this site where someone posted his progress and then disappeared without anything left.
I think I can help with the lod thing , I started to set important landmarks on full lod.
il post it when Im done.
Hope I help you guys I been watching this project sins the start back in the oblivion days and its the least I can do thank you for your awsome work
Here is my work hope it helps
http://www.4shared.com/rar/FaKnYvZO/FullLod.html
Thanks Sheo, it is a temporary solution until we have a proper lowpoly lod meshes, but still better than nothing.
your welcome I might add more objects if I forgot anny of anithing like that , and Zilav you did in just some weeks what should have taken months or more.
its so nice to be able to finally go back to cyrodiil again
That is awesome Zardalu! Yes, please share regularly. :) Something Mehh did for Skywind to find broken meshes was to do a quick navmesh and if the CK crashed on a cell he would remove objects until the crashing stopped, and then we would know the last removed object was broken. I don't know if that method would be any help?
That LOD looks great too. I'll see how much it breaks my FPS. :)
Weeks? I spent 4 days on it, and another day to find out why CK crashes without any errors messages.
After that I was just lazy polishing master file like adding outfits to npcs, grass, lod etc.
Well one of the biggest culprits for crashing in Skywind, was floral with collision. If you remove the collision from those, you'll probably stop a lot of the crashing. If you go to Solstheim in Skywind, you'll find some floral with collision(we didn't wanna touch Bloodmoon/Tribunal stuff yet) and you'll probably ctd if you touch it.
The crashing right now is mainly due to bad collision, you'll need to find someone who knows how to fix bad collision.
Zilav I am amazed by what you did I asumed you work weeks before even speaking of it , you are a god.
so about the LOD I have not lost anny FPS but , my pc is a high so errrr not really good for benchmarking , I only did cities and some of the biger bridges so it should be ok for most pepole
No fps loss for me, but it increased the ctd rate again (didn't think it was possible^^)
ouch errmmmm lets see mmmm I do know that my game CTDs near anvil therefor maybe one of anvils meches causes CTD
Hey Zilav, can I make a request? That you release the scripts you used to convert this? What I want to do is basically convert over the Tamriel heightmap mod, and then use that to create some LOD that won't have weird edges like the current LOD.
Converting heightmap and merging it in will require much more work than simply painting edge cells in the current master, which will take 1-2 hours I believe for someone who knows CK well.
Or even faster, because you can just create a new region in those places outside of Cyrodiil and use automatic region generator in CK to fill it.
Thanks to grass from anthelius and LOD plugin, it really starting to look like Oblivion. We just need trees and bushes now, and tone down landscape textures to make them less bright with Skyrim's lighting.
Zilav I think the problem with the lighting is the over done bloom , so what if we disable bloom in its immagespaces? il try that and report back see if it changes anything
oh and it looks like I forgot to set some of the wall section in full lod , il do that when I have time
Yes the current weather and imagespaces from Skyrim doesn't work good for Oblivion (easy to notice with blue tint on screenshots and weird lighting). If you can manually recreate them with Oblivion values (tints, ambient colors, etc.) that'll be really great. Use CS or TES4Edit to look for original values from Oblivion.esm
Proper imagespaces and weather are like half of perception.
dont tone them to far down oblivion is a bright place i like to think that spring just started there and skyrim its more fall/winter and when u are high up on the mountain and u look over cyrendel the bright green is very nice on the eye
I tried installing, but I don't get any buildings, just the NPCs and barrels. Does anyone know what might be wrong?
EDIT: I found the problem, I didn't notice that the meshes for this version should be in a tes4 subfolder.
Another thing, Eerana in Chorrol has a male voice. So far, it looks a LOT better than the original esm.
You installed meshes in the wrong folder.
zilav wrote:
I just noticed that. Thanks for pointing it out though.
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